Dogs

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Jack
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Dogs

Post by Jack » Tue Sep 28, 2010 3:11 pm

Huge problem for conducting CQB operations. Thoughts?

Itsahak
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Location: Lynchburg, VA

Re: Dogs

Post by Itsahak » Thu Dec 23, 2010 12:59 pm

Bang, Bang.

I like dogs. But I was bitten once, and that was all it took to really understand how bad it can be. The City PD actually had a K9 handler lose control of her dog during training. By the time it was over, she had been bitten 3 or 4 times on the leg, the K9 unit LT had a scalp avulsion from forehead to eyebrow, and the K9 was dead.

I like dogs, but I'm not playing with one I don't know. In an entry situation, we treat them like every other threat...
Wil
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Jack
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Re: Dogs

Post by Jack » Tue Jan 18, 2011 11:28 pm

Yes. Lethal force is an option. The big problems with shooting dogs is that they can be very difficult to shoot due to the fact they like to circle you(which creates muzzle sweeping problems with other team members). Also they are likely going to be the first thing encountered in a structure and the owner is likely to be in the line of fire down range. Also if you shot a dog you are most likely going to be shooting into the floor. If there is a basement in the house or if you are on the second floor you could easily accidentally shoot somebody(maybe another team member) through the floor.

Itsahak
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Re: Dogs

Post by Itsahak » Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:45 am

I have used OC on them successfully, but of course that means the team members behind are gonna have to walk through it as well. Taser's work well against dogs, provided you get both probes to hit. But then your losing time, and possibly clogging up the entry...
Wil
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Jack
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Re: Dogs

Post by Jack » Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:16 pm

It really can cause a problem. No matter what you do you stand a chance of getting bit. Although a bang usually takes the fight out of them.

I really hate opening a door and finding a big mean dog behind it. It's like a game show and you ask yourself, "What's behind door number one?"

badger
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Re: Dogs

Post by badger » Tue Mar 29, 2011 5:54 am

Sometimes its necessary go in,and you know,that will be problem with using gun....we had meth lab in progress, fighting dog and little child. Our k9 handler used ringo suit and bulletproof vest and electric baton,of course he had a covering man.
But it was extrem...
Sometimes you need to work with suspects (you need their cooperation,possible witness,etc..)and when they recognized,their lovely pet is dead is very hard work with them or their relatives. So we have to thinking about possibilities to go safely,but without shooting tge dogs.

Of course if things are go wrong,we shoot them all :)

Problem with dogs we have in family houses,when dogs are using as a guarders. When we go through the fence we are compromised,so we need to improve our dogdominatedskills from case to case. We cant use silencers.

Another point of view is using K9 in cqb,whats your experiences?

Jack
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Re: Dogs

Post by Jack » Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:37 am

I don't trust dogs. I have seen them miss too many people. I found a guy under a bed, after the dog had been in the room.

Dramatikk

Re: Dogs

Post by Dramatikk » Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:17 pm

*Snip*

I was just posting a bunch of nonsense. :?

But I do agree with the others above me, that dogs can be a pain to handle.

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Ryan
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Re: Dogs

Post by Ryan » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:16 am

PEQ laser in their eyes and they won't bother you... hopefully. In terms of dogs in your way.

Working with dogs though... maybe if you have runners?
CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

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"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

badger
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Re: Dogs

Post by badger » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:01 pm

Todays search warrant, pitbull vs. flashbang, the winner is flashbang.

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tacticalguy
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Re: Dogs

Post by tacticalguy » Wed Apr 04, 2012 3:36 am

I've had issues with dogs in the past. Personally, I'm a dog lover and would prefer not to harm an animal that is simply protecting their house. The best advice I can give is have good intel based on surveillance over a couple of days. Now, if you're not serving a warrant but, are dealing with a barricaded suspect, you may not have that luxury. I've used meat with tranquilizers for the slow moving night op. Used OC and flashbangs against dogs. I've also had the third guy in carrying a trank pistol. It all depends on what your SOP allows, whether your team is willing to accept extra risk and if your CO is a dog lover. 8)
If you have `cleared' all the rooms and met no resistance, you and your entry team have probably kicked in the door of the wrong house.
(Murphy's Cop Laws)

The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan. (Von Clausewitz)

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Ryan
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Re: Dogs

Post by Ryan » Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:56 pm

Image
This is apparently the dog involved in the Bin Laden raid. Cairo, the Belgian Malinois SEAL military working dog.

He has custom grillz too. ;) Titanium fangs.
I've heard they spend an average of $75,000 on training and equipping these dogs.
I've even read an article that stated the Bin Laden dog had a custom helmet/hat which had a PEQ laser, recorder. IR doggles? :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/user/CQBK9?feature=watch
CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

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jimothy_183
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Re: Dogs

Post by jimothy_183 » Thu Jun 21, 2012 6:46 am

Pics or it didn't happen. :lol:
semper acer , semper velox , semper trux , semper promptus

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Ryan
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Re: Dogs

Post by Ryan » Mon Jul 09, 2012 3:22 am

More for dealing with dogs:
http://loadoutroom.com/1307/dealing-with-attack-dogs/
http://www.special-ops.org/gallery-k-9- ... lice-dogs/

"If you do corner a dog:

If you find you have trapped a dog in a corner, keep facing the dog and slowly start to back away, giving it an escape route.
This will work on most dogs that are not committed to the attack but are instead reacting out of fear.
A determined animal who is on the attack and committed to the bite is another story.
It’s made up it’s mind to attack and is actively charging you.
It won’t back down."

Etc!


0:30+
CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

seal236
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Re: Dogs

Post by seal236 » Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:04 pm

If your team is not currently using dogs as apart of clearance then you are way behind the power curve.

A dog trained and selected correctly is a force multiplier, and WILL save lives.


As far as dogs on target: 90% are not going to bite and are more scared of you then you are of it. In a SWAT type scenario always have a snare pole on standby and someone trained to use it. There is no rush to search the backyard when there is a pit in the back. Dog fighters are normally human friendly.

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tacticalguy
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Re: Dogs

Post by tacticalguy » Sun Jul 22, 2012 9:50 pm

seal236 wrote:If your team is not currently using dogs as apart of clearance then you are way behind the power curve.

A dog trained and selected correctly is a force multiplier, and WILL save lives.


As far as dogs on target: 90% are not going to bite and are more scared of you then you are of it. In a SWAT type scenario always have a snare pole on standby and someone trained to use it. There is no rush to search the backyard when there is a pit in the back. Dog fighters are normally human friendly.
All good points. Thanks for joining in!
If you have `cleared' all the rooms and met no resistance, you and your entry team have probably kicked in the door of the wrong house.
(Murphy's Cop Laws)

The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan. (Von Clausewitz)

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Ryan
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Re: Dogs

Post by Ryan » Mon Nov 12, 2012 1:37 am

jimothy_183 wrote:Pics or it didn't happen. :lol:
Haha. I can't find the IR doggles one but...

Image
CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

badger
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Re: Dogs

Post by badger » Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:05 pm

Each dog is different, you cant bet that attack dog is human friendly, you cant bet every dog is human friendly. Expect the worst dog on the planet, especially in Swat raids and good dog will be very nice surprise for yor team. Depands on dogs master and way of training, intel is important.

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Ryan
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Re: Dogs

Post by Ryan » Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:57 pm

Image
Image
CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

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