Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITED & HTLE

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ClearRight
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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITET

Post by ClearRight » Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:30 pm

Promo video from RB1 showing a bit of OSC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uHd5NpI ... z_&index=1

I'm used to a version of the "Modified" technique, but I can see the advantages of the Israeli Limited - particularly with strong-walled houses and suspects barricaded in the middle of the room. In a house with thin walls, I feel I might just be exposing myself too much to gunfire through the walls before entering.
More guns and bullets make bad guys go away faster,
which in turn makes everyone in the area safer.
- Paul Howe

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Ryan
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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITET

Post by Ryan » Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:47 pm

Clear - You said exactly what Jack said but both points are so moot I'm sorry. If you stacked to buttonhook, straight, wallflood, insert entry. YOU WOULD BE AT RISK OF BEING SHOT THROUGH THE WALL. If you're saying you're at more risk being in a static position this is true, but you're at more risk running in with an immediate threat ALSO. STF SAPS, IDF have used these drills for years, and if you look at STF record - it works. Learn not to telegraph the rifle, learn to shoot then initiate movement and it will decrease risk.

I talked to Jason about his OSC, it's pretty similar with a few modifications and strict actions on. He has worked with some of the Israelis and therefore you can see those learnt techniques in his version. You gotta remember too, Israelis developed it because of the thick walls in areas they were operating. Sometimes it's best to get low and not overprotude the entryway with your barrel. Trevor was doing this for years, even working with people like Paul Howe on it way before Jason took stage. If you have to sign an NDA and fixate on OSC for what Trevor could teach you with good reason and without NDA, I'd recommend going to HTS LLC before RB1.

None the less remember this technique has been proven time and time again. It has it's pros and cons but it is great against real-threats.

P.S. On the near synchronization of entries:
"You can squeeze two guys in simultaneously (from a practical perspective) if one leads with his shoulder and steps in towards his corner with his lead foot far enough to clear the door. If its even tighter, switch to a bounding corner attack: first guy in bounds along the known wall, second man snaps the unknown corner with first step in the room. This tactic when executed properly devastates anyone in the corner." And remember: If used in a hall--you may need more hallway security as you're fixating towards room.
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"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITED & HTLE

Post by Ryan » Sat Jun 28, 2014 1:25 am

CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITED & HTLE

Post by Admin » Sat Jun 28, 2014 8:33 am

When I try to watch the video the massage "this video is private" shows and nothing happens?
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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITED & HTLE

Post by Ryan » Sat Jun 28, 2014 9:00 am

Admin wrote:When I try to watch the video the massage "this video is private" shows and nothing happens?
Fixed.
CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITED & HTLE

Post by Admin » Sat Jun 28, 2014 11:01 am

Nice
http://CQB-Team.com
http://www.youtube.com/user/CQBteam
Tactical education and motivation.training info for the soldier that wish to learn the art of CQB.

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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITED & HTLE

Post by Ryan » Fri Jul 04, 2014 12:56 am

CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

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Ryan
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Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITED & HTLE

Post by Ryan » Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:31 pm

Recent testimony to HTS HTLE:
"High Threat Systems LLC, recently one of my teammates attended a nationally renowned tactical shield school. He's been trained in the HTS method of CQB for a little over a year now. We by no means are experts in the system yet, but he was able to continually defeat the "bad guy" from the doorway. After being told to use our "old" technique of running into the room, he was continually shot by the "bad guy". I'd like to thank you for giving us a better way to skin the CQB cat. It sounds like the HTS method wasn't too well received by dogmatic instructors and I admire the commitment you have in trying to push forward in my opinion, a better way to do things."
CQB-TEAM Education and Motivation.

"Pragmatism over theory."
"Anyone with a weapon is just as deadly as the next person."
"Unopposed CQB is always a success, if you wanted you could moonwalk into the room holding a Pepsi."

ClearRight
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Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:39 pm

Re: Comment on Entry technique: ISRAELI LIMITET

Post by ClearRight » Tue Jul 28, 2015 11:04 am

Ryan wrote:Clear - You said exactly what Jack said but both points are so moot I'm sorry. If you stacked to buttonhook, straight, wallflood, insert entry. YOU WOULD BE AT RISK OF BEING SHOT THROUGH THE WALL. If you're saying you're at more risk being in a static position this is true, but you're at more risk running in with an immediate threat ALSO. STF SAPS, IDF have used these drills for years, and if you look at STF record - it works. Learn not to telegraph the rifle, learn to shoot then initiate movement and it will decrease risk.
Never saw your reply, sorry.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not pro or against either technique. They both have their advantages and disadvantages. My philosophy has always been to do what I can from outside the room, and enter if I have to. Around here, the houses are generally wood so the wall won't offer much protection either way. As for the stacks for entering, I'm not a fan of huge stacks in hallways, taking lots of time. More like a bump.
One problem I've found practicing all techniques against live opponents is that whether you use Sims or blanks, your opponents tend not to actually try to shoot through walls. Which would really bring up some issues and training scars (read: loooong stacks and poking muzzles into rooms when clearing from the door). But then, you can't really use live fire during FOF... So it's up to the instructor to make the opposition behave realistically and point out these issues.
More guns and bullets make bad guys go away faster,
which in turn makes everyone in the area safer.
- Paul Howe

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